Bump stops

Fitting oversize tires, raising and lowering, suspension modifications...

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Bump stops

Postby Horsehammerr » Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:05 am

Ive been considering neoprene bump stops on my front end. Thinking this could help stop the bottoming out nose dive that gives my tires the opportunity to hit the upper wheel well and my flares. Anyone have experiance with this application ? The 2" BL thing just bothers me with lifting the center of gravity. I'm not going to taller tires. If the only way I can get rid of this problem is more clearance than I'll look at cutting the top out.
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Postby F9K9 » Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:37 am

I don't understand exactly what you are having problems with. Normally increasing bump stops are associated with solid axles lifts and the increase in the up travel of the tires.
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Postby 04crewvt » Thu Aug 07, 2008 6:22 am

If the front is bottoming out / nosediving on stopping/cornering ,check your torsion bars ,if they are set soft (torsion keys have lots of thread showing) there may be room to adjust up to 1 1/2 inches of front lift which will stiffen the ride and help prevent that mushy feeling unfortunately at the cost of possible premature bearing/cv boot & joint wear YMMV. If you go this route make sure to look at the mod page for maximum adjustment and get the front aligned immediately after to prevent tire wear. I did this when I went to 30's and only bottom out on rare occasions, usually when heavily loaded and or hitting a steep driveway or ramp. I can cut corners that have the tires squealing and not have the front corner tuck under.
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Postby green02crew » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:30 am

I'm with 04crewvt on this one, looking at the photo you posted before in another thread, definitely in need of a tbar crank. I went to 30s on mine and cranked my tbars all the way up. Rides really stiff, been a good 20k or so, no probs other than one cv boot popping and slinging grease but thats a $5 fix. I had to get shackles for the rear though too to even it out as I don't like the rearward lean look. Sits about level with 2" shackle lift. I think that will accomplish what you're looking for. Handles better and never had rubbing.
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Postby HenryJ » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:46 am

If I recall correctly his has very little rear spacing and oversized tires with no lift.
I am not surprised it hits.

Check for extended bump stops made of polyurethane from Energy suspension products. Another idea may be the Timbren load boosters. These are used when a snow plow is attached to the front.

The body lift will not raise the center of gravity as much as a suspension lift. All you raise is the weight of the body. The heavy items stay down low where they were. The raise in the COG may not even be measurable using a 2" body lift, where a body lift is used. Concern about raising the COG is not a good excuse for not wanting a body lift.

If you want to keep the COG low and still want bigger tires, the 2" body lift is your only choice.
If you wish to run less than 4" of rear spacing and oversized tires, you will need a lift. That or cut off the fenders.
If you don't want a body lift you will have to go with a 5" or 6" suspension lift. Those are the only reasonable suspension lifts for out IFS. The 2" kits are a hack and cause more problems than they solve.

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Postby builder26 » Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:59 pm

I have the timbren front bump stops on my cc stiffens the ride a little but makes a huge difference with the plow on . They go on easy but the only thing that scares me a little is that my front end now sits on them all the time not sure if that is normal
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Postby HenryJ » Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:13 am

I am now sure that Reed will read the post he made above and know exactly what you were talking about when this thread was started.
The last day of our Moab trip we were in agreement that something needed to be done with the bump stops.
The rub when bottoming was not causing harm really, but became increasingly annoying after three days. It really does make sense that we need to upgrade. We raised the front and added larger tires. Adjusting the bump stops to match is just something that may have been overlooked.

Taking some time to think about this I came to the conclusion that they don't really need to be extended , or spaced down, but instead just need to be firmer. My reasoning is that I really did not have a rub when I was articulating hard and traveling slow. The rub would come when the force of the truck transferred hard during a whoop or dip in the road. Sometimes when hitting an unseen hole harder than expected.

So what did I do? I bought a pair of black graphite polyurethane bump stops made by Energy suspension products. Part # 9.9101G. They were $11.99 at the local Autozone.

The stud was long enough to add a .125" thick large diameter washer to space them down a little more.

After removal of the stock bump stops the differences are very obvious. The stock stops are very soft. They extend down nearly 2.75" but more than half of that length is easily compressed with just my body weight.
The polyurethane replacements are not as long. They are only 2.125" long. With the added washer they were just under 2.25" That is .5" less than the stock stops.
My hope is that the density will make the difference. I compared the two side by side and I am unable to compress the polyurethane stops. The stock stops I could compress to nearly 1.75".

Will this be the answer? Stay tuned...

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Oct 20, 2008 12:59 am

HenryJ wrote:...........Will this be the answer? Stay tuned...
Sorry that I missed this thread when I questioned options in the "trip" thread.

I am convinced that the bump stops are our next quest. For $11.99 we have a cheap start. I hope that the "graphite polyurethane" stops does the trick but, I am leary. We need to limit the up travel and if, Brule's initial "find" works then we are done with the evolution of the "miracle lift". Coming from a heep newbie background, I know that the stops go hand in hand with any lift on a heep. If, this works then we are done. If, it doesn't then we will just need to look at other non GM stops and make minor modifications to make them work. I can't see much more than a little "whittling" to make something work. As Brule said, the rubbage is not hurting anything but, the dayem noise is annoying and would annoy anyone riding shotgun.
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Postby killian96ss » Mon Oct 20, 2008 7:57 am

If you use the ES bump stops make sure you don't tighten them very much because the bolt will pull through the urethane which causes the urethane to split and fall of later.

Don't let my mistake become yours! :wink:

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Oct 20, 2008 1:05 pm

killian96ss wrote:If you use the ES bump stops make sure you don't tighten them very much because the bolt will pull through the urethane ...........
Ours just "snaps in" the holder.

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Postby HenryJ » Mon Oct 20, 2008 1:15 pm

Pretty soft, don't you think?
I didn't find longer unless you want to go Timberen. I convinced myself that it really is not so much the length, but the density. I have high hopes that the Polyurethane stops will do the job. I haven't had a chance to "test" them yet though. It may be a little while. I am still trying to get back in the swing of things around here.

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Oct 20, 2008 2:38 pm

HenryJ wrote:Pretty soft, don't you think?..................
Very soft. I am looking around for other alternatives. I can't believe what little up travel that we have. My lower CA is polished from the contact. What most people forget is that the the down travel is as important or, more so, that the up side. :wink:

I am hoping that the firmness is the answer but, when you have had waterfowl circling overhead for as long as I have, you tend to think about the next step. :lol:
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Postby killian96ss » Mon Oct 20, 2008 3:35 pm

f9k9 wrote:
killian96ss wrote:If you use the ES bump stops make sure you don't tighten them very much because the bolt will pull through the urethane ...........
Ours just "snaps in" the holder.

Image

I really don't think the ES bump stops are going to snap into the factory holder.

You will most likely have to bolt them in.

ES bump stops

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:10 pm

Epoxy or whittling on others works well. A hockey puck might even work on the LCA. I used two hockey pucks and "SHOE GOO" on my XJ and it kept the meats out of my sheet metal. I have some after market stops for an XJ here somewhere and I think they might be "plug n play" with cutting them in half. :wink:
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Postby killian96ss » Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:43 pm

I wish there was even half as much aftermarket stuff for S10's that is available for the Jeeps. :(

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Postby roadrunner » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:09 pm

I have and have been running the bolt in ES black graphite stops for over a year now. They seem to work well and I've had no problems/issues with them. Yes, there are roads and situations around here that will definitely test them out. The old stock stops were all but destroyed when I changed them out. Stock suspension, no lift, nearly full T-bar crank to level truck front to back, and BFG AT KO 235x75x15 tires.
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Postby F9K9 » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:42 pm

roadrunner wrote:I have and have been running the bolt in ES black graphite stops for over a year now. .................
part#? I looked on their site but, must have been holding my mouth wrong. :lol:
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Postby roadrunner » Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:04 pm

I picked mine up in the store on one of my (too often and too expensive) visits there. They are on the web site under accessories. After that you go to suspension bump stop. You have to compare and locate the ones that work for your application. As far as I know you can't directly look them up like other parts for our trucks on their site. :roll: 8)
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Postby HenryJ » Tue Oct 21, 2008 4:26 am

f9k9 wrote:
roadrunner wrote:I have and have been running the bolt in ES black graphite stops for over a year now. .................
part#?
HenryJ wrote:Energy suspension products. Part # 9.9101G. They were $11.99 at the local Autozone.

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Postby F9K9 » Wed Oct 22, 2008 3:23 pm

I found a set locally for $10.99 and tossed them on . I temporarily have small washers on them but, will replace with larger ones soon. No chance to check them out but, I have a good whoop on one of my routes home from work. I just need to catch the intersection "clear". :wink:
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Postby HenryJ » Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:22 pm

The Timbren load boosters look suspiciously similar to the rear stops on the early 2000 fullsize Chevy.
The are a little larger diameter and longer that stock for sure. The same bellows shape with a center hole.
I am going to grab a set on my next salvage yard run. I may not use them, but I want to see if they would work. Might be a good option for someone running a plow.

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Postby HenryJ » Fri Oct 24, 2008 4:36 pm

So Reed, did you get a chance to test them out?
I gave the ES bump stops a little test today. No rubbing, but I am quite a bit lighter than the usual trip. Probably short about 500# from the usual.

You would think that would be good enough, right? Nope.

I did pick up some bump stops. I picked up a whole bag of various stops that I thought might work. They are cheap at the salvage yards. No one ever wants those.

Image

Left to right: GM PART # 15712438 $11.08 each (new). These are off of the rear of late '90s and early 2000 Chevrolet fullsize pickups.
Next is the stock bump stop.
Last is the Energy suspension Part # 9.9101G $11.99 pair.

The first set has a hole in the center.

Image

This would have them act much like a rubber spring. The front of the fullsize uses the same design , but the mounting cup is welded to the chassis. That is why I chose the rear stops. They are a direct bolt in installation. I know the fullsize ride on the stops all the time. There is no clearance on the a-arm.

Image

A little increase in spring rate would be nice. That is my thinking right now. This might just be the answer. They are soft. Not as soft as stock, but flexy. It works for the fullsize, why not ours? This would be a gradual increase in rate. As they compress they exert resistance. Not as harsh hopefully.

I added a comparison shot of the polyurethane bump stop mounted.

Image

You can see that even with the 1/8" thick washer to space it down a little there is quite a space. I don't think that is bad. I do have some reservations about them though. Harder may deliver more of the forces elsewhere. They might tend to stress other bushings? Steve mentioned that he ruined a set by over torquing. What if I pound them? They might crack and break out just the same?
Steve did link longer versions in the link posted above. I really don't think those are the answer. The two longer ones require a bolt to be threaded into the nut. Upon compression this chews on the bumper. Heaven forbid you should compress to the point of hitting the threaded portion of that bolt, or that moisture should enter. they are a real pain to cut off when the bolt will not come out. They burn forever and smoke something terrible. I definitely prefer the stops with a threaded stud. ES has only one length that will work in that case.

Now that things are being upgraded for the front, what about the rear? I only had the rear rub a couple times, but heck what if I want to really jump this thing? Time to look at that too.

Image

On the left: GM PART # 15023225 $21.76 each (new). These are off the back of a late '90s Chevrolet Tahoe. They are Polyurethane and solid. No hole through these. As you can see they are quite a bit longer than the stock ones. The rear has been raised more than the front though, so this may be a better match.
As you can see they are a different design. They can be slid into the channel for the stock stops and with a little work, can be tightened in place from above.

Image

I jacked one wheel up as far as my jack would and it did not touch. the tire had a couple more inches to rise yet and the stop had over an inch. These too are flexy. not as much as the hollow fronts, but still should offer some cushion.

Now to find a good place to jump it and really test things out.

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Postby F9K9 » Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:10 pm

HenryJ wrote:So Reed, did you get a chance to test them out?
I gave the ES bump stops a little test today. No rubbing, but I am quite a bit lighter than the usual trip. Probably short about 500# from the usual.

You would think that would be good enough, right? Nope.
Nope, I got side tracked with the P0155 but, I was worried they would not work out. I have a set of Heep stops around here somewhere. They are longer than the pictured ones but, could be shortened.

Image

A Heep's lower stop could be added to the lca using a self tapping bolt. My front's are like this on the rubi but, they are inside the lower coil spring bucket.



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Postby F9K9 » Sat Oct 25, 2008 5:18 pm

Looking to Brule and waiting on his evaluation on full size bump stops. I will continue to run the original ES ones he picked up. I was looking for various things to assist me with modding a heep shield when I ran across the bump stops that I had misplaced. They are indeed plug-n-play with our oem stops ! Worse case scenario I could start shortening them.

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Postby HenryJ » Mon Dec 29, 2008 8:10 am

I pulled a "Dukes of Hazard" yesterday and sort of jumped my truck over a creek. The stops work GREAT!
I am now convinced these are the answer: GM PART # 15712438 $11.08 each (new). These are off of the rear of late '90s and early 2000 Chevrolet fullsize pickups.

I had the winch on the front and hit it much harder than anything we did in Moab. :thumb:

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Dec 29, 2008 4:40 pm

Great news, Brule. Does the full size bump stops fit in the same hole that prevents the stop from spinning as you tighten them or does it need to be altered.?
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Postby HenryJ » Mon Dec 29, 2008 4:53 pm

It fits the same. Direct bolt in just as the original.

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Dec 29, 2008 9:45 pm

Thanks! I really think that the Magical Mystery Lift is complete now and I want to thank you from all of us.

The trucks are older now and there will hopefully be less resistance to taking a sawzall/reciprocal saw to the fenders on our CCs. The flares are no longer an option but, their costs, versus a Line-X type alternative coatings, is now very much cost effective.

I am sure that the bump stops were already in your head but, that last day of the WRT's "chase for camp", made it as much of a priority for you as it did for me. Slow trail riding and minor crawling did not create an issue for me here in the east.
Pick up speed and it was evident that we had a minor issue that needed to be fine tuned.

As I have already mentioned, I am sure you had that rolling around in your head when I mentioned it on the radio. Might not have had much time around you, in person, but, your response read loud and clear. It was kinda like, "yeah, yeah I know, I am working on it as we drive, push on!" :lol:

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Postby HenryJ » Mon Dec 29, 2008 9:57 pm

:lol: I fly more by the seat of my pants than you may have been led to believe.

I updated the parts list on the Mystery Lift I think you are right in that we found the last piece of the puzzle.

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Postby F9K9 » Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:36 pm

HenryJ wrote:............I fly more by the seat of my pants than you may have been led to believe...........
Relatively the same thing as "having a method to my madness"! The end result is the same.

Now we just need to split the tire lift section into two categories. Yeah, I know, it ain't gonna happen. :lol: Lifting for show or mud versus low cog and trail riding.

Sigh, it never ends. :lol:
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Postby Jongo88 » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:36 am

I just picked up two bump stops from the bone yard. I had to cut the tip off them so they would even fit. You guys must have your t bars cranked more than me. They work though. My tires would hit on big bumps but I don't think they can now. I have a big bump that they would rub on the way to work so I will try it tomorrow and see if they hit.
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Postby HenryJ » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:10 pm

Install them with the truck jacked up. They ride on the stops all the time. Sort of a rubber spring boost.

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Postby Jongo88 » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:42 pm

I jacked up then dropped it down so I could get to the nuts. I have big hands so they where hard to get too. I cut the tab off so I could twist the bump stop instead of the nut. Then I tightend the nut. The truck rides good too. I drove it up on one ramp and the tire don't go up in the fender any more. The ride to work will tell me if it works. So far I'm happy with the cut out fenders and the bump stops.
How long do you think they will last?
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Postby F9K9 » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:13 pm

Jongo8 wrote:...........How long do you think they will last?


And the answer is........

Image
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Postby Jongo88 » Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:53 am

Just did the test... Still rub on the big bump on the way to work. Guess I will just have to slow down....
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Postby green02crew » Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:29 pm

Just had my front end rub after going over a snowbank too fast, new stops on order. I have yet to have the rear rub so we'll hold off on those for a little while.
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Postby F9K9 » Sun Mar 29, 2009 12:32 am

green02crew wrote:.............I have yet to have the rear rub so we'll hold off on those for a little while.
I don't ever recall my rear tires rubbing but, maybe I missed it from the spine chilling noise that the front tires make. :lol:
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Postby green02crew » Sun Mar 29, 2009 7:48 am

I never had the front rub so this was new to me altogether. The inner lip on the fender was bent down a little after the rub. I didn't see any damage to my tires. I took a hammer and persuaded it back into place. Hopefully the stops will help with that issue. And here I was thinking 31s would fit okay over the 30s! I still think they'd fit fine though. My friend said instead of bump stops I should just get a body lift. He changed his mind quickly when I said okay I'll order it, when do you want to help install it?
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Postby HenryJ » Sun Mar 29, 2009 7:57 am

Reed, did you ever install the fullsize bump stops?

I am fully convinced they are THE answer. A simple bolt in swap. Work just like the fullsize and the way ours should have come from the factory.

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Postby F9K9 » Sun Mar 29, 2009 8:44 am

Yep, installed and whoop proof as far as I can tell!Image
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Postby green02crew » Fri Apr 24, 2009 11:59 am

Okay, I'm working to install my full size front bump stops. I took of the front wheels and managed to get the old stop out. I jacked the truck up by the frame to get clearance for the new stops.

Here's the issue:
I can't get a wrench in to get on the nut and install the new stops. I can barely wiggle a wrench on but then there is no room to turn it. Also I cannot get a socket to fit in period, just not enough room. Any thoughts from anyone?? How did HenryJ and f9k9 get a wrench in there and still be able to turn it?? The control arm seems to be in the way.
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Postby F9K9 » Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:46 pm

I cheated just a little and turned the bump stop until it settled in the "notch" I also had the frame on jack stands and played with raising and lowering the A arm.

Ummmmmm :oops: ratchet straps have become a popular tool in some circles and almost are as important as BFHs.
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Postby HenryJ » Fri Apr 24, 2009 6:09 pm

Same here. I turned the stop until it had to seat in the notch. Then let the jack down and turn the wheel so you have room to work. There is not lots of room, but it is not bad.

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Postby green02crew » Sun Apr 26, 2009 3:21 pm

Thanks for the help! With a little finness and time I managed to get them on. Now theres no more rub for the fronts!
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Postby Horsehammerr » Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:34 am

I was wondering how tall these GM 15712438 and 15023225 bump stops are ? And could we not put the solid one at both ends and help stop the bottom out problem even more ?
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Postby F9K9 » Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:49 am

They are in constant contact now. They just compress when needed. I toyed with the idea of a hard rubber hockey puck on the lower a arm but, with the angle it would not have stayed unless bolted in.
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Postby Horsehammerr » Sun Jun 28, 2009 4:12 pm

What I mean by solid, is, the 15023225 GM bump stop is solid. The 15712438 is hollow. It seems to me the solid stop would help even more, for those of us without a Body Lift to keep from bottoming out and hitting the top of the fender. :?: 8)
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Postby HenryJ » Sun Jun 28, 2009 5:08 pm

They may be too rigid? I have not tried the solid ones, but I think the hollow ones will do all you need.
The rigid ones may be too stiff to even install?
Timberen springs look suspiciously similar to the ones we are running. I think they have a good thing going.

I managed to rub mine once last weekend. A hard hit with the winch and trailer on. It may have been a little piece of the broken front flare rubbing? It might have been the rear? I couldn't really tell. Not bad enough to do anything differently though.

If you are at the salvage yard, grab a set of each. I did. Try them. I am happy where I am so I'm not interested in trying the solid ones.

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Postby Horsehammerr » Mon Jun 29, 2009 2:52 am

Thanks for the help. I will pick up both and experiment. 8)
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Postby Horsehammerr » Thu Jul 02, 2009 3:00 am

OK, I got the solid GM-15023225 on the front and the hollow GM-15712438 on the rear. Simple exchange and both came from my stealership in polyurethane. I've got 1/4" space till contact at front and 2 1/2" space at rear. Although the rear has never been an issue they will for sure slow the bottoming of the springs. I am looking forward to a test of the front. 8)
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Postby Horsehammerr » Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:49 am

Got a test to the front with full size solid stops. I turned left into an uphill drive way a little fast on purpose and bottomed out the right side. It did rub, but only slightly and my flare did not get any damage. :D I think the bump stop was a major help, this uphill drive way has a drainage dip at entry that's about 3" deep and 36" wide. The upslope is right at 30%, so it was quite a pronounced hit. I'm satisfied that in a reasonable speed there would have been no rub. :!: 8)
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Postby Jongo88 » Mon Jul 06, 2009 4:58 am

I too have the full size bump stops. I have this big bump in the road on the way to work. I use to have to slow down to 25 so my front tires would not rub. When I put the full size bump stops in I could go 35 before they would rub. Then I put the bilsteins on and now I have been up to 50 and no rub. I have 31's.
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Postby green02crew » Thu Oct 29, 2009 6:48 pm

Little follow up over time from my full size stops on the front. With no weight in the bed I can jump the truck all I want and no rub. With a 700 lb load... oops. The bigger more aggressive tires still rubbed. It was my fault and I shouldn't have hit the "bump" that fast but didn't see it and was going across a field. May have gotten some air and the landing wasn't soft. Happens. Anyways the fenders were finnessed back into place with a BFH and then coated with rubberized undercoat. Looks like a body lift would have been a good choice for me. Oh well.

On another note, the rears have yet to rub even with that load in the back. My tires must not be too big for the rear or I just have enough lift to compensate. So the only real rub issue was and still is the front.
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Re: Bump stops

Postby dozer1530 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:51 am

i have a 03 cc zr5 and do yall know how to get my front bump starts out are the bolt in or pop in. mini have dry rotted and i need to get new ones
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Re: Bump stops

Postby HenryJ » Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:34 am

They bolt in.

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Re: Bump stops

Postby dozer1530 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:36 am

ok ty
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Re: Bump stops

Postby PonyKiller » Mon Nov 29, 2010 12:54 pm

Anyone have a good line on where to get the fullsize bump stops? The GM part number listed way back at the begining is now discontinued and I was only able to find one of them in the junkyard that wasn't dryed out and falling apart. Is there a good place to buy them new? Any help would be great.
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Re: Bump stops

Postby HenryJ » Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:34 pm

GM Parts Direct still shows them
GM PART # 15023225
CATEGORY: All
PACK QTY: 1
CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $43.86
OUR PRICE: $25.50

That part number is still good and they are available. I checked the local dealer to confirm.

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Re: Bump stops

Postby CraigS » Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:24 pm

I'm brand new here, and I don't even have a crew cab. I do have a 2000 Blazer 2dr 4WD though which I'd like to do some mild modifications to, and this place seems to have a lot of really knowledgeable folks. So I hope you don't mind a lurker - and the occasional stupid question.

On to my first question. From my reading, I understand that what are being referred to here as bump stops are actually intended to be part of the front suspension. They are intended to be in contact with the lower A-arm and the compression of the rubber is supposed to act in conjunction with the torsion bars. Do I have this wrong?

I'm planning on a torsion bar tweak for the front end and it seems that lowering the lower A-arm away from this "torsion bar assist" is the biggest drawback. It looks like the longer stop from the rear of a full-size truck as mentioned here might be the perfect solution. Am I on the right track?

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Re: Bump stops

Postby HenryJ » Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:53 pm

CraigS wrote:I'm brand new here, and I don't even have a crew cab. I do have a 2000 Blazer 2dr 4WD though which I'd like to do some mild modifications to, and this place seems to have a lot of really knowledgeable folks. So I hope you don't mind a lurker - and the occasional stupid question.

On to my first question. From my reading, I understand that what are being referred to here as bump stops are actually intended to be part of the front suspension. They are intended to be in contact with the lower A-arm and the compression of the rubber is supposed to act in conjunction with the torsion bars. Do I have this wrong?

I'm planning on a torsion bar tweak for the front end and it seems that lowering the lower A-arm away from this "torsion bar assist" is the biggest drawback. It looks like the longer stop from the rear of a full-size truck as mentioned here might be the perfect solution. Am I on the right track?

Thanks, Craig

Yes. I think that you are on the right track. I can not honestly say the stock s-series stops work this way, however the full size stops do. This method does work well for the s-series too.

This same sort of set-up is availablbe aftermarket. Timbren offers a rubber spring.

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